How to Reinvent Your Investment Strategy
I ended up getting my first job on quote
unquote Wall Street at a Jordan bfort
Wolf of Wall Street spin out Boiler Room
that I look over at the guy in his
Mercedes and he’s smoking like Gordon
gecko he looks like Gordon gecko with
this with the hair we end up clicking
for some reason I believed in it so much
my conviction was so deep that this
thing was going to work but I had to
exercise that Faith versus what was
I’m talking about real adversity they
were internally in the office buying the
shares for my clients and saying you’re
an idiot it’s going to 50 you know next
week and I was like whatever man I’m
doing risk management I think it’s gone
up enough and I need some
[Music]
food in today’s chat with Eric I’m
actually going to talk to him a little
bit about how he got into this business
and some of the trials and tribulations
had through this business because as
we’ve heard over the last few months he
particularly likes highly volatile areas
he likes his crypto some areas in which
people probably don’t want to put so
much risk but actually some of the
context for the positions he takes could
come from the experiences he had moving
into this business and then how he
developed his own understanding of what
he likes to invest in and and how he
invests in it over that period of time
so hopefully we’ll get a few insights
into the mind that drives the investor
into these volatile stock areas and just
a reminder that although this is
probably not going to have as many
investment ideas as we normally have
this is still for engagement
entertainment and educational purposes
if you’re investing have your own time
Horizons your own risk parameters and do
your own research before putting any
positions in
[Music]
place welcome everybody to investing in
the mine field and welcome Eric thanks
much Roger I look forward to the uh
unconventional way to get into the
business that I share well that’s what
I’m hoping to hear because I mean what I
love is that um you you interviewed a
couple of people we’ve had Rob mcguan
you’ve interviewed um Rick Rule and what
what I think most people find
fascinating about those interviews and
generally when we talk to investors is
is that first question and it’s the
question you always asked and it’s a
question I’ve not actually asked you
I’ve always sort of started about you
know a couple of years in but how did
you get into this business what what
what took you from high school
university school as as you guys call it
and and then into the investing world at
that very beginning I came from a blue
collar uh not poor uh ghetto but a blue
collar Rough and Tumble sort of suburb
of Milwaukee
Wisconsin every um you know male uh in
my uh hierarchy had up until the point
when I was a kid
um been like a machinist or a tool maker
working in factories probably going back
and I know they were going back to
before the World War II and you know
immigrants I guess you could say from
different backgrounds mostly polish some
German I guess I’m a mut from all over
Eastern Europe uh also had you know sort
of the hit in the bottle after work
problem with a lot of the you know
stress of that with everybody in my
family and a lot of financial problems
uh because of that and just you know
stins of unemployment and I remember my
mother carried the family on wages of
being a hair stylist uh which didn’t pay
very well I used to remember asking her
for her uh
W2s seeing that it was like you know 15
grand a year 18 Grand tops and then tips
and I’m like I look back on it now and I
wonder how we made it through and I had
a I had a great level of support a lot
of that was sacrificed to give me you
know the semblance of a of a decent um
uh image in the sense of growing up
however I always had this thing in me
where I wanted to make money anyway what
got me hooked on the stock market was my
senior year of high school I took a
business econ class and that was the
first year that I actually got my crap
together uh partially because my father
had died when I was 17 and I guess I got
scared straight or whatever it was and I
really dove into this business econ
class where the state of Wisconsin in
the US uh still to this day they do a
10- week uh for seniors in high school
they do a 10-week program um it’s for
the stock market they give you a mock
$100,000 my econ teacher um uh Mr
McCarthy
he said listen if you call up go in the
Yellow Pages back in the day and you
call the investment firms the brokerage
firms in downtown Milwaukee and you say
that you’re a student and want to talk
to a broker about some ideas because you
have the stock market game a lot of them
will be very friendly to you and will’ll
do that so I went home and I started
smiling and dialing I called uh and I
got a guy on the phone his uncle was the
largest producer at Merl Lynch in
Milwaukee and I got his nephew and so
was just building his book but he gave
me a couple of picks and I had called
some other Brokers and put you know put
those picks into play and I also started
charting on a whiteboard I didn’t have
you know a computer or anything so I
would put the closing prices of these
stocks that I followed and see if there
was a pattern in week six of the
$100,000 program thing we were in the
top three in the in the state for our
returns and we ended up winning the
state of Wisconsin in 1993 cut which is
known as this little hole suburb uh
that should not be competing in this
type of thing when your dad you know
other systems dads were actually at
maril Lynch and could give them picks
and we won it and I believe that uh it
was something to the effect of like a
45% return in 10 weeks so 100 turned
into 145 that got my attention and I had
gone to my grandmother and asked her for
$1,000 she was the only one in my family
that had any savings but anyway then I
went to school and along the way
educated myself on stocks and investing
in the market and I just didn’t I wasn’t
into school I it wasn’t for me I was
basically hanging on with my grades I
took a lot of electives that were like
world religions philosophy psychology
business the rest of it I didn’t care
about and so it was a really interesting
time in my life when my roommate one of
my roommates uh that we lived in a house
called the dungeon which was usually
stained with beer on the floor and if
you’d walk you’d stick to the floor from
the parties we would have we had uh you
know some good guys that were in there
but one of them in particular who’s
still a good friend of mine to this day
who runs a value fund uh out of Denver
he was a head of the the finance
Association he came home one day and you
know I think at that point I had learned
a little bit about you know token on
something and and chilling out and and
relaxing and doing my thing in college
like a lot of us possibly did and he
came home and he said hey man you got to
get your uh your one tie and suit or
whatever on and come to the finance
association meeting tonight you’re going
to love the speaker this is your guy and
I was like what you know because he had
never invited me before in year like a
year and a half and for some reason
there was a speaker there was a storm
that happened at that time in Wisconsin
so who whoever was flying in from one of
the more reputable firms uh to recruit
Juniors and seniors in the finance
Association for various positions
University of Wisconsin Whitewater
although division 3 has a very very uh
well-respected finance and econ uh
education
department and he said so instead one of
the guys that graduated last year is
working for a firm a stock brokerage
firm in the suburb of Chicago he’s
coming in to recruit
I go to this thing and I’m watching this
guy’s got slick back hair he’s got an
Armani suit he’s looking super sharp and
he starts talking about how the big
firms they like to allocate assets and
they like to uh you know go into
conservative your your 6040 portfolio
with wealthy High net uh worth
individuals and he said we’re a little
different we like to do what are called
OTC growth stocks and he gave like an
example of one that went up 20 20 times
and he was just uh very persuasive and
it was on my level and so I went up to
him and I just said hey Mark still
remember his name hey Mark would you
ever consider hiring someone who hasn’t
gotten their uh their bachelor degree
yet he said well Eric you might be in
luck I’m actually a unique situation in
this business I’ve only got my community
college degree out in New Jersey and he
ran the office for this firm in Chicago
gave me a card and so call me on Monday
so did you just give up University there
and give him a call and off you went was
it did did you sounds like you didn’t
finish your University degree you
obviously decided that the world for you
was the the wild west the wild East
whichever end you’re at of the financial
markets so I Monday I called them up I
had an appointment to go down to this
area Arlington Heights in Illinois which
is a suburb it was a over three-hour
drive from where I was at University I
went to my mother’s home in Milwaukee
first she helped me
buy my first real car which was a used
Volkswagen Jetta that I loved and I
wrote it through college but I couldn’t
keep up with the registration and
insurance payments so I ended up putting
the I still remember it here’s a plug
for David Hobs Honda if you’re still out
there when you used to be able to put a
license plate that says you know license
coming this was just bought from this
dealer I had that on there for two years
I had no no registration I had nothing I
was just like winging it uh out there
waiting to get pulled over and I was
racing down the interstate going about
80 miles an hour trying to make it there
and then all of a sudden the blue and
reds are going off behind me and I’m
like it’s over my dream uh of this is
over because he’s going to see all the
you know the uh uh the citations that
he’s going to bring to me they’re
probably going to impounder my car my
license is now in valid cuz I haven’t
updated that nor the insurance or
anything else he pulls me over and to
the point where we’re slowing down and
there was one car in front of me that
started to pull over too because he
wasn’t sure if he was pulling him over
and right at the last second before we
came to a stop I mean this is my memory
of it at this point he goes around and
he pulls the guy in front of me over and
I was sweating and I took off and I went
to get to the interview and I show up
down there and uh it’s a it’s a big
Bullpen I ended up getting my first job
on quote unquote Wall Street at a Jordan
bort Wolf of Wall Street spin out Boiler
Room that I had no idea was that existed
at that time um and that movies weren’t
out we didn’t know anything about this
all I know is there were a lot of guys
in their 20s driving Mercedes and
Beamers and Porsches in the in the lot
and everybody’s standing around on the
phone and there’s a lot of energy in
there and I go sit in the marks the the
manager manager’s office so him and I he
takes me in his car to go get a Euro and
he’s talking to me and I look over at
the guy in his Mercedes and he’s smoking
like Gordon gecko he looks like Gordon
gecko with this with the hair he’s just
a very you know we end up clicking for
some reason and he’s at the end of the
interview I’m like I’m only I’m just
graduating my second year of undergrad I
have no money I don’t know what I’m
going to do I was looking at Ohio State
cuz I could get better Financial Grant
ANS and loans and he says you know what
Eric I’m going to give you a shot and
here’s the deal here’s your Series 7
books you got to pay for these and then
you start studying and then you’re going
to get into the business and we’re going
to train you and off you go I always say
when I look back on my life it was uh if
you will God using evil for good because
if I never went there for training on
how to sell how to open accounts how to
call people and get strangers to become
a client that I could develop many of
which I still have but I ended up
realizing pretty quick this was a scam I
overheard a phone call I was there very
late one night cold calling at 8:30 I
was the only guy around next to my
manager’s office which was closed and I
could hear the concern in I think they
were based in New Jersey there were
rumors this particular company had ties
of the mob later on all this stuff I you
know you would never know this as a 2021
year old kid coming in just to try to
you know wide-eyed and wan to learn
about Wall Street and make a career so
anyway I got my series7 through them
went through the trading program you’re
looking at guys everywhere with Rolexes
and this and that and all this stuff and
then I’m looking at some of the things
we’re selling at $8 a share on the offer
and five on the bid so I’m going to each
of the managers like why is there such a
large spread here so if I get Tim Jones
The Farmer from from Southern Illinois
to buy a th000 shares he sends in eight
grand if he wants to sell it tomorrow he
gets five back is that right yeah these
are growth stock companies you need to
give them time to grow so they keep
these big spreads and I was like this is
this is you know this these
guys are robbing people so I ended up
getting out of there quick I wasn’t
there for even uh two and a half months
but I had my Series 7 and I went to go
work for an ex Leman and uh ex Bear
Sterns and I had to start from scratch
uh minimum wage was the Illinois State
uh deal so they had to pay people like
us that were commission only minimum
wage and it’s a tough racket right
making hundreds of phone calls a day
trying to get people just back before
the internet to like you know get a lead
I used the formula that I learned from
uh the boiler room but I used it in a
way where I’m like okay I’m pretty
convinced that these guys they’re
legitimate veterans I was that Schneider
Securities waiting tables out in a um
out in a mall at a hulaan trying to pay
my bills and work all day paying rent my
grandmother again saving my butt and
giving me a shot the only one who had
any money whatsoever at all you know to
to in her bank account passed away of
brain cancer right before this all
happened and it actually allowed me I
talked to my uncle to stake
the 10 grand that she uh was going to
leave for me to to get this journey
started and that money ran out pretty
quick by the time I didn’t make any
money for months I started getting
eviction notices on my door in this
condo complex and twice I remember got
to the last minute and I went downstairs
and there was a nice woman who ran these
group of complexes and I would go to her
and I would say look I have a check
coming next Friday I can give you half
of what I owe you and then the other
half in 2 weeks and will be cleared up
and she would work it out with me and
then I wouldn’t get evicted the third
time it happened though I went there and
I’m like all right I’ve taken this to
the final step it’s an eviction eviction
notice I went downstairs to have a chat
with my friend and it she was gone I was
literally homeless um I did not have a
place to stay I found somewhere it was a
friend a very loose friends parents
guest room that I was able to sleep in
it got really really really tough I had
been building up for months a position
in a stock called micad that had 3D CAD
software but there was a moment when I
was 21 that I had to face moving back
home with my mother because I couldn’t
it was just not working out and I had
nowhere to live and I was going into the
office but I had such a firm belief that
this micad was going to work so I’m like
if I leave
now these guys are going to get all my
accounts are going to make a bunch of
money on that and if I go back to where
I come from I’m never going to get out
of there that’s just the way it is with
a town like that and so I ended up I was
a spiritual guy at that time like
praying you know what do I do uh there’s
a YMCA that I don’t think it’s still
there but it was on uh Chicago Avenue
near State Street in Chicago and it was
filled with crackheads and homeless
people they charge 10 bucks a night to
sleep there I ended up I I went to the
YMCA and I said because I still had a
few days left at my friend’s parents
house I said if how much is it going to
cost me if I if I stay here per night
they said 10 bucks I walked from there
back to the train station and I made a
decision I don’t care what the it
takes I will sleep in an alley I’m so
close I can’t stop now I’ll sleep with
these crackheads and I will make some
friends along the way I’m going to keep
it going no matter what and that was a
huge moment for me because just weeks
later there was a guy I believe he’s
passed away by now but when you look at
the way things used to work in the
promoter business there was a guy that
was notoriously known Rafi KH Rafi KH we
get a uh call from the IR woman at modad
whom by the way everybody in the office
was neck deep and micad we were you know
these were all veteran Brokers and we
all loved it we were all making a huge
bet on this thing and we were buying it
at you know $4 $5 $6 I was buying the
warrants that came out because it was a
small underwriting at a dollar dollar
and a half then the stock doubles to 10
the warrants go up 4 100% and rafie gets
involved at you know eight nine 10 bucks
a share on micad and sure enough within
two months this stock is trading massive
volume it’s at 17 bucks it’s going
higher so it goes to 25 and you know
we’re seeing all this selling come in
anyway I’m now up so I’m up multiples of
my clients everybody’s still buying in
the office and I’m like I think I have
to take some of this off this would be
appropriate and by the way I live on a
freaking in a in a crazy crappy
hole I’ve never had money to buy my
family Christmas gifts the last couple
years if I sell it in November I’ll get
paid right by right by my between my
birthday and Christmas so I sold like
15% of my position and I made 40 Grand
in a month and it was back in the late
90s and it was the first taste I had but
little moments like that were very
critical for me to stick around I think
a lot of us have had those I think you
mentioned it was 2003 where you started
getting into the mining space what what
was it that got you from Trading these
dodgy stocks in boiler rooms to going oh
I think I like mining companies when I
was going into the internet boom the
first time I ever made any to me what
was real money was going into the year
2000 with the internet boom where I was
making 50 plus Grand a month for eight
months um and I was 25 years old and I
started like you know buying things and
having a good time and then I gave it
all back on the back end of that I
didn’t understand
Cycles I had a painful education in the
Woodshed from that experience the
markets and I learned about that
coming back in and you know what I ended
up being attracted to really was what we
call alternative Investments if somebody
said what do you do I would say I’m an
alternative investment adviser not a
broker not a financial adviser I was
there for that stuff and um you know so
gold fits in well there doesn’t it it’s
like here’s a piece that you can make
something that you I can talk about and
we ended up later on I ended up leaving
the the business with managing money
from a licensed manner but Fidelity was
the furb that we cleared through at that
time this is back when I was about to
leave the business and I was trying to
do a direct mail campaign to get people
to custody their gold with Fidelity it
was a new program you could do it in
your IRA you could do it in a single
account and they wouldn’t let me send a
letter it wasn’t even a security but I
couldn’t Market anything I couldn’t grow
my business but anyway the gold that I
got invested into I bought my first gold
coin I believe it was like 2003 gold was
somewhere around $350 or $400 an ounce
and I started to learn more and more
about that my sources of information
became you know they were more focused
on the value of gold and silver and hard
assets that I wanted to mix in with some
of the highrisk high reward High beta uh
fund of funds that we were investing in
inside of some of the venture Capital
deals and Tech that we were involved in
medical technology was the specialty of
the firm that I worked for and I wanted
to put that all together so that I could
actually have clients that I could
develop relationships with and then the
mining stocks became a natural second
thought you know just like if you buy
you find crypto you buy Bitcoin then you
hear about eth this is what happened for
me for mining stocks so in around 2004
or five I believe I bought my first gold
mining stock for myself and then I
started to monitor that space so it
sounds like in many ways you’ve been
constantly um I’m going to say not
Reinventing yourself but it sounds like
the key thing here is being inquisitive
because you have moved from different
sector to different sector now obviously
you say’ve been in minus really since
2003 for 20 years but in that journey
and now obviously this is a big leap now
but You’ you embraced crypto was that
how did you get into that I mean because
the key thing for a lot of investors is
that very hard for a lot of investors to
move away from their comfort zone they
get into a style or an area and they
believe in it you know and that’s why we
get these tribal uh groups particularly
on um social media what what what is is
it because of that rather chaotic
beginning men that are constantly
churning re re kind of Reinventing is
that you think what has driven you to
continue looking at all these different
things I don’t know if it was churning
as much as like I felt like my education
my self- education was evolving and I I
went up the rung into more and more
sophisticated areas within the business
I remember being very young I was on the
phone when we would take positions in
like that micad you know I was very
young uh first you know couple years in
the business trying to survive and what
got my attention was the underwriter
when I saw that it went public and we
were following this thing going public
and then they got the the warrants and I
looked in the Deep press release and I’m
like so wait a second who’s getting the
underwriter warrants why am I not
getting some of that what with some of
our deals who’s who’s the banker that I
can talk to I think I like that part of
it too the warrants sound pretty good
and I had made a lot of money for people
on that modad with focusing on the
warrants where there was The Leverage
right out of the gate but as I got into
it more and more I started to look for
what is you know what are people smarter
and richer than me doing and what do
they think that’s always been my
approach even to this day if I’m
learning from folks that are experts in
a certain area and I trust their
judgment I will gladly become a student
at the seat immediately and absorb that
information so anyway when I went and I
did my homework and I said well I want
to become an internet marketer my whole
thing was I was learning about the
internet and I wanted to do what was
called inbound marketing instead of for
such a career of pounding the pavement
and you know ABC always be closing and
talking and prospecting and going after
all kinds of people to get you know this
big list of people that ends up into
little drips where they become your
clients that’s taxing after a long time
I’m like I want to do this wiser the
internet allows for that what if I can
create funnels where every day whatever
I’m doing whatever service I’m providing
whatever product I might come up with um
that I walk into the office and I’ve got
emails or calls from people that want to
talk to me already what the heck what a
concept right and I loved that and I was
like I want to do that but I’ve got to
get out of the out of the business
because they’re they’re not going to let
me market things online so cut the cord
and I had had compiled a family office
database and I always wanted to find the
family office database because I was
going to them for some of the things
that we were doing and then I realized
that there was a gap in the market in
the raia side the raas there was only
one there was a woman out of the East
Coast who had a CRM that you had to pay
five grand a person for a subscription
to get access to all the RAS so those
two are what kept me afloat I started
learning Google AdWords I started
getting people buying the data then I
got the president of forbes.com called
me or emailed me one day when I was like
trying to keep my office in the John
Hancock Center in Chicago and afford it
uh and said I’m on your raia list uh but
your buttons don’t work I want to buy
one of your lists can you call me and I
saw president of forbes.com and I
thought it was a joke and so I called
him he became my biggest client became a
friend we we got to know each other over
years but anyway when I launched the
gold investment letter it was in the
fall of 2011 which was the top of the
market right but I’m like I’m going all
in on gold it was very hot it was the
top literal month and then for four
years brutal bare Market over four years
that I had to build the letter and I did
it slowly and I did it right and I ended
up um I ended up building that along the
way but then around
2012 probably I had you know I I had had
some subscribers that I attracted I had
some of my older clients that came with
me to the letter and at some point
somebody sent me an article on bitcoin
and I brushed it off and then another
time I saw an article about Bitcoin
myself I read it I brushed it off
somewhere in 13 I believe I had a couple
of people that had said they wanted my
opinion because I was a gold guy right
so they’re like What’s the deal this is
digital gold do you think it’s legit and
I didn’t totally brush it off then but I
didn’t know how to buy it uh I’m not I
wasn’t technically savvy so what I did I
believe it was 13 or 14 I bought a bunch
of Bitcoin domains like Bitcoins
broker.com and stuff on Go Daddy
thinking all right well I don’t know if
this is legit or not but I’ll take a
flyer on putting in 400 bucks a year and
and renew my do domains because if it
does become big I don’t know how to buy
the thing but uh maybe I’ll make some
money on the domains it finally got to
the point where it was like 20145
whenever uh Bitcoin went up to 1,200 and
pulled back to 200 I was kind of
watching it out of the corner of my eye
I remember being in an airport and
Bitcoin Point had gone back to like 400
to 500 from that 200 and it was
something in me because one of the
benefits that I have from the time that
I came up I’m a tape reader you know
what I mean like I’m I also have a feel
for stocks and markets I still listen to
that in my gut regardless of what I’m
seeing on a technical chart on a screen
and I’m looking at it and I’m like this
asset whatever the hell it is is going
higher and it’s going to survive and
it’s trading like it’s going higher so
then I went and I opened a coinbase
account in
2016 I bought my first Bitcoin you know
a couple few Bitcoins it was not a lot
of money a couple Grand I put in at 450
bucks of Bitcoin and then I believe it
was the end of April or early May
2016 I recommended Bitcoin officially to
all the gold investment letter
subscribers and it was it was like just
under five 100 of Bitcoin so that was my
start but again as many of us know I
don’t even know if you’ve started this
journey at Roger you’re still probably
kicking the tires while it makes us all
rich but you you know it’s it’s a whole
new learning process because I I did it
then and I I say like officially I
recommended to my readers and for myself
I’ve been in Bitcoin since 500 okay but
it was stupid funny money I was playing
around it was a couple Grand I ended up
selling it all at 2500 early in the in
the run that happened towards the end of
17 um and I traded it a bit this and
that but it got my attention because it
it reminded me of the internet bubble
and why that got so big my my view is
that the market is a forward-looking
mechanism it sees in the future somehow
and however the time discount on that is
I don’t know exactly but I believe the
internet bubble got so big where you’ve
got like askjeeves.com trading for you
know 500 bucks a share or something um
was because the market saw how large of
a transformation this was going to be
for our lives and for Commerce and for
everything information communication and
then that bubble when it burst uh you
know if I would have had and taken the
time to learn more about the mechanics
of using the internet that was a mistake
I didn’t want to make again so when
Bitcoin crashed in late 17 early 18 I
said to myself this run was the
2 uh this was the 1999 2000 run in the
internet there’s something here this
Market sees that is going to be here for
a long time and that’s when I I doubled
doubled triple quadruple down I had a
plan of what I was going to do which is
after Bitcoin goes below 8,000 in from
the correction of 20 I was going to
start automatically accumulating it and
spend a lot of time learning about it
and that’s what I did I’ve got over at
least 15,000 hours of study on
blockchain web 3 crypto Bitcoin you name
it and then um it became a big part of
my life because in 18 especially in 19
and then the crash of 20 um I had been
very vocal even with the gold investment
Letter People and half of them told me
to go f off because it was the gold
versus Bitcoin crowd I said look you
don’t have to be that way there’s room
for both here it’s a us against Fiat so
chill out and make some money so it’s
the learning process you know the
churning yeah the churning happened uh a
bit from this Focus to that Focus
because I was learning on the job and I
was trying to get smarter and trying to
get ahead what would you say was the
your most important trade or position
not necessarily your most successful one
but the one that yeah maybe it was
Bitcoin maybe it was that realization
from Bitcoin because it open so many
doors but what would you say was your
your most important single pos position
or trade in terms of either what it
taught you what it helped you do what
Financial Security you get could be all
of the above
motorad motorad was because I was 21
years old with no money every week
looking at how I’m going to pay for food
transportation and upcoming rent and in
the face of it I believe believed in it
so much my conviction was so deep that
this thing was going to work but I had
to exercise that Faith versus what was
I’m talking about real adversity
thankfully because I was young I think
that that helped but it was like a life
or death type of thing for me it was
like you know if this doesn’t work or if
uh you know I was betting it all on this
story and so doing that in the face of
of such like
uncertainty uh modad made my career
because when that one hit I saw how I
could make money how I could make a lot
of money I made people a lot of money I
also made a big mistake then too because
I only sold 15 20% of it but I did it in
the face of every single other broker
around me that had been veterans and my
bosses were still buying it and I’m like
you guys are idiots we’re up you know
we’re up with the warrant we’re up 6X in
like 12 to 15 months I had the I was
glad I had Christmas coming up and it
was part of my decision otherwise I
might have capitulated with them and
either not sold any because there was
pressure at that time they were
internally in the office buying the
shares for my clients and saying you’re
an idiot it’s going to 50 you know next
week and I was like whatever man I’m
doing risk management I think it’s gone
up enough and I need some food
so like oh you’re an idiot I mean it
seems to C crop up a lot you know on the
internet even today on that front you
know on so on the reverse front what
would you say was the most chastening
thing was it the anibis of 2008 2009 or
was another another single trade where
you kind of look back and go I didn’t
learn from that you know 089 was
uh was bad because I was a grown man you
know I was like 33 years old and I had
no money that because I was dealing in
Venture and all venture it’s just like
owning a restaurant during covid like it
just done it stopped and I had to sell
off a lot of my positions that I had
invested in at the bottom to continue to
operate in life and it hurt a lot the
big Saving Grace there for me was that I
had spent the prior three or four years
really getting my personal life together
you know I stopped being an idiot and
partying and all that stuff and I I was
getting healthy and I was doing a lot of
like self-work so when that pressure
came and it was that bad first of all I
despised it I was like I can’t believe
I’m in this position I’m in a studio
apartment in Chicago I’m you know 13
years into a professional career in this
stuff I have nothing to show for it I’m
wiped out and I had to come to a
conclusion where I said quit the
self-pity dude everybody’s getting
slammed right now what are you going to
do next and frankly here’s what ends up
happening with my career and and it’s it
is true that those big adversities can
be some of your biggest breakthroughs
because what did I
do I discovered in 2008 I started using
LinkedIn I was one of the early LinkedIn
users I had meetings every day around my
house during the whole crash and after
it when nobody was doing anything yes I
was looking for business but I was
looking to be active and make contact
and I used this incredible new tool to
do it very early and that ended up me
starting groups in LinkedIn I ended up
but like within a a year at like 2010 I
was having you know 40 or 50 High net
worth individuals in a restaurant in
Atlanta to raise money for one of our
Venture companies back you know getting
back on my feet from all the seeds I
planted I was forced to learn about
technology then you know in 2012 13 I
found Airbnb I started renting out my
apartment on Airbnb back then and it was
paying for all of my costs and I was
going back and forth from Hermosa Beach
and renting a Land Rover from a friend
for 500 a month and my housing or my
flight costs were being paid for back
and forth for two years so it it taught
me a lot of Ingenuity it taught me
creativity and it also taught me that
there’s only so you know a lot of us
that have an addicted personality or
whatever we are very hard on ourselves
and you know I’m sure you can relate
like if we’re not oper operating in a
level of perfection like we we get you
know we really are very angry
potentially at ourselves and I had to
learn a lot of lessons through that and
just say listen man you know quit quit
the whining and the and and the party
you’re ready you’re finally ready after
all this preparation of living your life
right let’s start from scratch Let’s
Build It Up and this time hopefully you
can keep it all and it’ll sustain itself
instead of going away in two years so to
finish off then going forward what is
going to be your formula for not getting
angry uh don’t go broke I don’t like
being broke broke makes me pissed off uh
but I was just angry two weeks ago I had
a situation with my
Foundation where uh men in Morocco uh
were physically assaulting women that
run a dog shelter on the big dog guy
they poisoned 12 dogs and killed them
and they were trying to physically throw
the women out uh that were the only dog
rescue in this area of Morocco so I got
pissed I put all the business to
the side and I was going to go straight
to the king and I’ll get there I didn’t
need to go that far but I had
mercenaries lined up that were already
licensed to come and guard the shelter
uh strapped uh to stop these people from
attacking these women and these dogs
they had given them a fake eviction
notice they had to be out of there in 3
days even though that group had lost two
Court battles for this situation so I
still get angry but it’s usually when
it’s like an injustice not you know and
that I just say this I got to step in
here that’s rare you know there’s listen
just start focusing all your time on
political news you’ll get plenty angry
pretty quick don’t waste your time on
that guys in the meantime make sure
that you’ve got some assets put to the
side off which you can live so that you
can then enjoy speculating in the higher
octane stuff yeah and you know enjoy
some of the fruits of those victories
when you take a lot of if you have a
high-risk reward life and say you took a
shot you know some of these guys like I
was watching that documentary about
Travis KAC and Uber you know and he did
a lot of stuff that he probably
shouldn’t have early on whatever but
look at that thing that just went public
you know he was the one dinging the Bell
on the
NYSC uh with his dad and you know like
that that’s your life you know if you’re
going to go in there and dig in and make
some real changes um and then it starts
to come I find one of the biggest things
that I run like men’s Mastermind groups
and all that stuff with friends and I
have some other you know things that
really help me to not get well if I get
angry I’m going to have it put in
perspective by other people and try to
learn from that but also you know when
you make a lot of money a lot of people
they just squirrel it all away again for
some future that doesn’t exist we have
today I’m staying in a very beautiful
home in Miami Beach that I don’t need
it’s just my dogs and I but it also is a
situation where like I almost died two
years ago I don’t know how long I’m
going to be here quit being so
cheap enjoy it if you have a victory do
something for yourself for somebody
around you or actually even better yet
give it away to somebody who needs it a
fantastic Journey volatile Journey
interesting Journey uh but it’s good to
have that perspective because it also
does give a little bit of perspective
around some of the way that you approach
the markets I will be chatting again
next week about uh the broader markets
themselves and whatever’s developing
over over the last week or so thanks so
much Roger I appreciate the
chat so as we heard from Eric there his
investing career in fact his life has
been uh quite a dramatic one there’s
been lots of highs lots of lows but
there’s been lots of change and I think
it was interesting to listen to How Eric
has talked about how the change in his
life has often informed the invest
investment and investing that he’s done
and how he’s never allowed himself to be
completely removed or cut off from any
opport unity and when he’s seen some
opportunities he’s he’s really gone with
them with both hands with a lot of Gusto
and really gone into learning as much as
he can about those areas and that is
really something that we should all be
doing when we’re trying to do our
investments so there’s quite a lot uh to
take away from that
[Music]
π₯ ππ’ππ‘ Real Vision and watch the full episode: https://rvtv.io/3vtCggd
Eric Muschinskiβs investment career has taken many turns for the better and worse. Bouncing back from the setbacks has helped inform the winning strategy he now employs. As part of a series in partnership with the Gold Investment Letter (https://www.goldinvestmentletter.com) and Phenom Crypto Letter (https://phenomcrypto.com), Roger Hirst speaks to Eric about dealing with the unpredictable gyrations in fortune that trading and investing can bestow upon anyone.
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