Gold Equities at a Turning Point: Insider Buying Signals Hidden Opportunities – Cam Currie

Join Jeremy Szafron, Anchor at Kitco News, and Cam Currie from Canaccord at the Vancouver Resource Investment Conference. Cam chats abou the current state of junior mining companies and the gold market, addressing key issues like the shifting investment landscape post-COVID and the impact of economic trends on gold prices. He also provides insights into the future of the gold market, particularly with an eye on the 2024 forecast. This interview is a valuable resource for anyone interested in understanding the complex dynamics of the gold industry and its investment potential.

VRIC coverage is sponsored by Snowline Gold —

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0:00 – Introduction to Cam Currie and Gold Market Analysis
1:29 – COVID Impact and Shifts in Gold Investment
3:28 – Evaluating Gold Stocks and Junior Miners
5:08 – Consumer Economics and Gold’s Position
7:08 – Insider Perspectives in Gold Investment
9:05 – Gold Sector vs. Trendy Investments
11:16 – Gold and Silver Market Trends for 2024
13:20 – Understanding Gold Equity Market Dynamics
15:19 – Challenges in Raising Capital for Miners
17:59 – Strategic Investment Tips for the Future

#gold #silvermarket #juniormining #miningstocks #economy #equities #investmentstrategies
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Kitco News special coverage of the Vancouver resource investment conference is brought to you by snowline Gold hey everyone welcome back to kco news I’m Jeremy saffron joining us today from the Vancouver resource investment conference day two I should say is a man that you should know we’re going to talk to exclusively about gold here camp Curry with Kord thanks for being on the

Show thank you so much for having me appreciate listen Camp you’ve been around a long time and this brings me to my first messaging here is because we’ve been talking a little bit off camera about the retail audience coming to the market for gold Junior miners there’s

Been a little bit of a lack thereof recently with buying so I’m curious with the evaluations of a lot of these Junior mining companies at where they are why are they staying clear well it’s just not the Juniors it’s the sector overall and uh you know we’ve been you know

Talking about this with our clients and and and messaging a lot of interviews I do is that uh the investor of today has left the sector you know they in the past they chased other sectors like cannabis crypto digital they went shopping in the United States um most investors now go through wealth

Management investors they buy ETFs right so stock stock Pickers of today um are not in the in as as big as they were in the past Canada traditionally has had a very big mining investment culture and uh we’re mining capital of the world and you look at the money flows from uh the

Big corporate uh Pension funds and that into the resource space it’s gone down since 20 2001 2002 H so was it just Co then when we saw a little bit of a top of the market when this outflow started to take place and we haven’t seen anyone

Enter vac in when was the timeline well 2020 when Co hit then of course everyone looked for insurance policy and that’s where gold had its rally um gold still is trading near its all-time Highs but the old gold equities have sold off since 2020 because again the money flows

Have never count into the equities right you know gold is an Eastern story right now it’s not a western story Western Gold ETFs in the last uh 18 months have gone from 3700 tons down to 2600 tons and yet last year for example in China the second best performing asset class

For investors was gold of 133% so gold is in desire the Eastern parts of the world but the Western world is is now chasing the Nvidia and and the cycle that they they you know made all the money in the last cycle so is it just

News flow is it is it a lack of due diligence I mean you’re talking about Chinese buyers obviously on on the investor side really coming into the market drunk this East versus West do something we don’t know well again it’s the the discussions come up many many times about dollarization right and uh

You what you have is you know transactions in the US dollar 20 years ago represented 60% of transactions now they’re 40% and so the US dollar is people have been moving into US dollars and the gold ownership continues right because most people don’t know this but

Gold is one of the top three Reserve currencies in the world and so you look at the Euro US dollar and gold and the thing about gold is it’s the only one that has no debt obligation no printing press or political attachment now I know that seems to be the the standard uh

Name for why bit people own Bitcoin these days and that’s the the new the new kid the block investment and the narrative is Flowing so much into that direction we have no narrative in our space in the Western World at all do you think that they’re building it up though

I mean you know the excitement on these floors right now it seems like people are really understanding that there’s an opportunity here with these low stock prices to enter into the market and really do well well the values you know you look at the pavs on these companies

And you mentioned the junior companies you can look at some of the developers the mid tiers I mean they we’ve never seen this this cheap and in such great financial position I mean I look at B2 for example you know pays you at 5 and a half% dividend yeld and they’re de free

Right and so you know we had never seen that in the past right so how do you advise clients then you know where to put their money but also how do you educate them that this would be a good choice for them for them to invest their

Money into well I I guess you go back in time and uh I remember being back in 2002 2003 when gold was Mak it it move out of $350 $400 an ounce yet everyone was buying the dips on the tech bubble that fell apart and they had a rally

Back 40% and I think that’s what we’re seeing right now in US equities and so again I think we’re in that situation right now we’re gold to 2,000 the US dollar is going to I think roll over here and the recession will become recession in 2024 debt will become a

Topic and so I’m telling people you got to buy when nobody else is and I think it’s really important is that people inside the industry the guys I’ve worked with over all these years they’re all buying stock right and they’re saying I’ve never seen valuations as cheap

Before so when the Insiders of the industry are big buyers of the stock hit tou right you know you you recall uh obviously in December we saw that record price of of uh of gold when we look towards this year 2024 in the forecast you’re calling for recession some are

Saying this is the year of gold this is the year of the breakout price where do you where do you stand with those two well first of all recession I mean the data points are are you know you can you can look at the data points I mean we

Talked about the employment numbers but last last year last nine months eight or the last nine times they’ve revised them downward so unemployment is going up and you can’t tell me when you get rid of a high paying job at Google and you get somebody working at Starbucks that the

The same paying job right so the data is not representing the real position of the consumer the consumer’s getting more and more stretched the United States what they have for them is they have a 25 2 and half% mortgage yeah and so that’s why they’re they’ve been able to

Weather themselves longer and uh but you’re seeing the consumer tightening up I mean you look at uh services like a firm buy now pay later sales up 40% at Christmas time in the United States so people are are buying Staples like at Walmart they’re using a firm to buy

Staples and they’re buy out pay later he’s not a strong consumer yeah so I think the lag effect on this recession I mean the leading ecomic indicators now have been um 20 months a low of decline uh unemployment is going up and you’re feeling a tightness and there’s a lag

Effect I think when it becomes that’s when if States will come down dollar a weeken and the big big thing is that you have a lot you have a $2 trillion deficit United States last year when you had full employment record low unemployment never in the history have

They had an economic situation like that where they printed a $2 trillion increase in deficit what happens when weakness happens right your deficit goes up and interest rates are where they are the cost of financing this debt is going to put downward pressure on the US

Dollar and gold I think as a reserve currency will get much more lelink yeah it’s interesting we had a couple speakers on stage this morning talking about how expensive it is to raise Capital right now for a lot of miners but also how expensive it costs to

Actually have a really good asset so break those two down and how important a team is to really bring this together and where you think the value at is for some of these stocks well that’s one of the problems with the industry too we’ve had aot a number of disappointments

Right you know execution has been for we have gold at 2,000 people are going well how come these stocks aren’t doing better well when you have some of the leading companies lowering production and increasing costs um there’s there’s margin squeeze right and so the management of some of these assets has

Has not been that well handled right and so what I do is I you know I have my whole cord mining team I have probably 40 clients who are Geo’s Engineers I do a lot of principal business I I I get close to people who are the Builders of

These companies and one of the things that is very very important is with the Insiders insid ERS are buying stock and they have a big stake in these companies you know that that’s alignment yeah and and you know I have a track record I’m working with manager teams that sold two

Or three companies in the past last cycle we sold eight companies to MERS and seniors so I’ve been through this before and so I’ve seen markets with is a void you know it’s going to change you know I remember back in 2001 I was referred to as a dinosaur right and I

Looked at that and actually that inspired me to work you harder because I went out to investors said I know this sounds unorthodox everyone talking about nor but I’m here to talk about gold and uh and I don’t mind being called a dinosaur because it just tells me nobody’s paying

Attention right and I learned a long long long time ago that sometimes opportunities come along there are so low risk so high reward and no one’s paying attention and I think with what’s going on the US Equity markets again you know people talk about some of these

Gains that have been taking place but they don’t mention that you know coinbase for example which what $120 a share lower bottom at four 40 what was $325 a share they don’t talk about where was back then they just talk about these incredible gains in the last 12 months

But don’t forget where some of these companies came from and yet Gold’s at alltime high is and no one’s paying attention right well that comes so in this mem stock type of atmosphere where you just have news flow news flow news flow do you find that everyone’s just

Buying the news selling the rumor or is it you know there’s a lot of inflow of capital going into whatever is trendy now but for long-term Investments this is more advisable oh totally CU you know chasing narrative I mean I remember walking into a appointment I had and the

Guy who was hosting the apartment said yeah I just bought zoom and I said what’ you pay for it oh $500 I said $500 a share for that do you know the fundamentals of the company no but I use the product right I said but that’s the

Herb mentality yeah and so you have this massive herb mentality but what’s happening now is that her mentality is going into the ETFs and and so you look at something like an apple Apple’s seven4 in a row of declining sales and it still has a $3 trillion market cap it

Has so much spray into the ETFs and I think you know an examp the Canadians can relate to look what happened to cannabis space right so you had all these cannabis shs go stupid because of all this ETF flow now do you think the ETF buyers or cannabis stocks in the

United States knew they were buying ta Ray at $260 a share now at $2 right and so that’s the thing the narrative is so important and what I’ve said this many many times I mean we’re in a stadium with 60,000 people and there’s a there’s

A a match going on down on the uh on the on the field and Tesla’s there Nvidia is there Apple’s there Microsoft there and everyone’s lined up trying to get in the stadium and in the gold sector we’re 10 people in the nose be section trying to

Get the wave going right no one’s going to pay attention to us so I guess you know when no one’s paying attention there’s Great Value to be bought that’s when you buy right because eventually someone’s going to turn their head and pay attention interesting let’s get into

The cost of capital for a lot of these guys trying to raise Capital now do you think that the lack thereof will bring in a big m&a type of Boom in here where you can see some of this consolidation take place m&a has to be done for the

Right reasons and uh you know John Goodman and I were on a panel once and we were talking about a lot of our companies are trading up point two times now we don’t want the m&a happening now because you get a mid tier senior ATT at

One times St or 8.8 times St we don’t want to Forfeit these companies too early um recent mmaa that just took place that I’m very very involved with is caliber take over a marathon now we Embrace that because that’s a 1 plus 1 equal 5 you got a 280,000 oce producer

Company with $110 million debt free buying a company that that was voided some capital and in construction it made sense for both parties to come together the rate is going to be a creation of a 500,000 ounce producer which is a mid-tier and the re mid tier rating on

This should have a significant impact the deal closes uh end of this week interesting but that that makes sense but some of these other ones I mean you get some of these companies that are under capitalized and they can’t raise money and they get taken over it’s unfortunate it’s terrible you I mean

It’s for pennies yes right uh talk to me a little bit about what some of the issues are with the gold market this year that you are anticipating I mean you’re you’re quite bullish on the precious metal space uh let’s talk about 2024 your forecast for gold silver well

I don’t put a price on anything I I think it’s going higher I think the uh the shift is going to take place I think I think the narrative will start questioning the equity values in the United States and the recession and as the recession US dollar weakness happens

I mean we have a shift taking place we have I call the autocracies versus democracies in the world and there’s a there’s a move to De dollarize and I think that move is going to continue and I think the US dollar is going to continue to weaken so if the dollar is

Weakening what Curren water it’s not just a trend things like bricks everything’s kind of showing that this isn’t going anywhere you know and and the thing about it is too when you look at the weakness in the dollar Gold’s at alltime highs in all other currencies

Except for the US dollar when the US dollar weakens gold will start breaking out in US dollars if if you’re in Turkey for example if you own US dollars in Turkey US debt in Turkey you got destroyed last two years if you own gold gold went up by 300% so they’ve seen the

Value of it when your currency declines the North American investor isn’t even looking at that right now because they don’t think that’s even in the cards right now and I think when people aren’t looking at things and the rest of the world is observing something pay attention to that and I think you

Know from the equity side you know most people don’t know this but the entire gold Equity sector globally the market cap is less than Home Depot so when you talk about the Cannabis ETF spraying into cannabis stocks when the ETFs start spraying into the U uh the gold equities and that it

Doesn’t take a lot of money to move into these thingss yeah you know the waiting in the United States is one quarter of 1% of funds who’s in gold and you got guys like r del was saying if you don’t know gold you don’t know the history of

The currency if guys like s Dr are talking about buying gold because of the US dollar weakness and yet the waiting is at one quarter of 1% right so if we’re wrong no one’s paying attention if we’re right and it goes from a quarter to 1% what’s the impact going to be on

These equities well and how much of that market is kind of held up I mean we’re coming into an election year in the United States no one wants a bad economy coming into that how much of it is just narrative base and this bubble is just keep it’s growing well narrative is

Everything States unfortunately think narrative is I mean we all have our phones glued to our heads since so we’re cost to be bombarded by narrative and the financial media narrative everyone follows suit right and so narrative is everything and uh but narrative is driving people to a fault now because I

Think people are living Way Beyond their me because they feel that they can just keep on consuming consuming despite the worries that people keep on talking about and so I think the narrative is is is going to shift here in this next 12 months um election we’re going to

Obviously see a very interesting situation in the States but there’s 40% of the world is going through election this year there’s a lot of changes taking place we we’d probably need that here in Canada yeah well I mean with any luck I’m not allowed to say anything

Outside of that what I would like to talk about a little bit more just before go is copper let’s talk about copper this year I mean it’s obviously a huge precious metal we’re seeing a lot of news flow about it some supply and demand issues we can get into the Red

Sea if you will but where’s copper going now and where do you think this is going to stand for this well first of all I love copper I I think copper longterm is is a phenomenal uh play because again you know if you look around this room everything involves copper right and

Most people don’t realize that that the electrification of the world requires copper what’s what makes interesting for copper these days is this the Supply s side there’s no new project coming on the planine you know the lundine group just held a uh a uh tour out of AA

District which is this filo Jose Maria uh ngx and it’s it’s the biggest new copper discovery on the planet and and it’ll be how many years until it’s in production whereas you look at the mines in Chile and that they were mining you know at 1% copper now they’re a qu%

Copper so Supply is a huge problem I still think we have a recessionary call that’s going to keep proper in this range for a period of time but any if it gets down to three and a quarter you know you you’ll get spot coming off cor

But you not get anything built free Port was saying that you know they got to see $5 copper before they start committing and we’re at 375 right now yeah so I think one of the Swing votes is if China starts stimulating but they have a massive overhang of of inventory of real

Estate and infrastructure build out I don’t know if they need to do that or can do that at this point yeah so longterm copper there’s no there’s no copper project coming out the pipeline the other thing too with copper is that a lot of the copper Supply uh flows go

To China right they have such a hand a finger in Africa South America now and uh what’s going to have to shift too is in North America we have to start pering these copper projects because copper price can be at $4 or5 but if you can’t

Get the physical what good is it right do you think there’s a disconnect between the investor and the actual uh Community the buyers that are not realizing that a lot of these projects they’re just brand new I mean they’re not license they’re not permitted how long this is actually going to take to

See some effects in the marketplace on the supply side or on the investor side investor side I think you know what investors are driven by greed yeah and fear and or boredom right and nowadays investors is looking for inst gratification um I think once we get a

Narrative of critical mass and I’ll give an example uranium two years ago was a dirty word right now it’s a green ESG word and you look at urum just went $100 a pound um chemico two years ago was left for $12 a a share yeah it’s $65 a

Share so the sentiment changed and things shifted I think the sentiment when it shifts and what we’re doing that the rewards are so big just have to be patient I that’s one of the big things you have to buy these stocks and just tick them away as long as the check and

Balance of what’s being delivered by Management on the asset you know we have look for management teams and assets that have growth trajectories right and uh we aren’t in the junior exploration player right now because you know someone discovers something they have to raise money I I got involved

With visel silver for example they had the discovery hole three and a half years ago I didn’t really get involved till 6 months afterwards when they had six wegs turning and the Napoleon vein was actually turning into something meaningful and I went wait a second so

Then I spent a lot of time with management and uh now they just came up with the new re resource 330 million ounces uh they’ve done that in 3 years and they’ve looked at 15% of the district I mean there’s an exciting story yeah no kidding but again the

Stock’s down 40% from its high and yet the ass assets gotten better and better CU nobody’s paying attention and there’s no money flows so looking at that I know you don’t want to give specific stock tips obviously but looking at the future where you put your money in 2024 what

Would you advise any specifics I have a select group of seniors intermediates but my real love is the developers in the mid tiers uh in the making you know the caliber Marathon merger for example that just makes economic sense I mean caliber before the Takeover they were

Had 110 million of Bank debt free they go up from 60 to 285,000 production and uh they were TR it five times PE multiple and now they’re using the cash to deploy to grow an asset which was one of our favorite Assets in a jurisdiction of safe the maritimes

Newand specifically and they’re going to unlock the value the management team has done this time and time again so it’s not like they’re doing a one-off they’ve done their du diligence on this they know what they’re doing they’re cap capitalized and they have to go to go to

The equity markets if you’re at the win with the equity markets right now that could be a challenge you can have a great asset under development but you know because the share performance has been so poor because no one’s paying attention especially the Juniors because there’s no money flows from from

Indexing you know you look at like I remember talking to one of the mid tiers and they told me that their stock jumped 30% in three weeks because two index funds came into out the United States nothing fundamentally changed but just the indexes came in just the inflow and

So if you’re a junior junior company there’s no index ratings whatsoever MH and institutions seem to be standing by too yeah well again no one’s paying attention the money flows you look at the institutional money out of Pension funds and that in Canada it’s been the decline Australia on the other side they

Have what’s called super annuation funds and they’ve been deploying tons of capital into the mining sectors they they have more money invested in the lithium space than they do than Canadian institutions have in Canadian mining companies overall because they’re focused on their domestic production Dem and they also don’t have the distraction

Of us Equity markets being beside them so they have a they still have a very active audience of investors in that Arena I mean my business um practice there’s not a lot of us in Canada that manage wealth in Ms and Mining right very very few of us whereas when you

Know 15 years ago everybody did it so that’s my competitive Advantage is this the worst you’ve seen it no but it’s it’s it’s worse in terms of value I’ve never seen such great companies with great value get so unloved and uh you know so from a value proposition selectively there’s some

Phenomenal values out there um could it get worse I mean I you never say never in this business right ex but again as long as you’re buying great assets great management teams that have a game plan and they’re capitalized to grow their assets then you can weather those storms

Yeah buyer’s market that’s for certain it is a buyer market and you know and again eventually you know a year from now hopefully you’ll have me here and all of a sudden the explor exploration game is ignited because of a discovery summer where people realizing there’s no

Projects coming on the pipeline I mean I can count on one hand the projects coming on the pipeline into production it’s pretty wild and yeah you have to replace how many ounces mind a year yeah but the disconnect between understanding that and the fundamentals just not well gold buyers are gold buyers Equity

Buyers are Equity buyers and the equity buyers aren’t even paying attention to the fact that Gold’s where it is right now and the other thing too just to finish off on on the sentiment of investors um uh independent broker firm in the United States um they’re they they provide services for professional

Traders the number one trading instrument for American investors on that platform today are buying call and put options on ETFs on a daily basis so that’s where the trading mentality of speculation gone to we used have speculators in the mining space in Canada we have a we have a culture of

Investors and once they start seeing returns they’ll come back in right yeah of course U but it’s it’s amazing how how that investor just waiting for that initial jump and then hopefully start piling in yeah that’s the goal yeah yeah yeah but again I think you get some

Great discoveries and there’s there show there’s a number of great discoveries that are looking very exciting abolutely and uh so you know this is a great platform and an event to actually you know come explore some of these companies and educate yourself too yeah and for a lot the future is looking

Friendly and uh hopefully bright as well cam Curry panor joining us thanks again for being thank you for tuning in I’m Jeremy Safford and you can catch more coverage at the Vancouver resource investment conference by signing on to our YouTube channel and subscribing we’ll see you next time Kitco News

Special coverage of the Vancouver resource investment conference is brought to you by snowline gold